The Deep Dark Road: Living With Schizophrenia and Coming Back. Ryan’s Story.

 An Acid Trip in college led to “never feeling the same again” - to actions to feed drug habits, to inner thoughts of suicide and harm, a diagnosis of schizophrenia, treatment - and now, a Master's Degree and full-time work.

The 3 Moms ask Ryan the questions our sons aren’t ready to answer.

• What does psychosis feel like?
• What is the effect of weed on your symptoms?
• Do you tell potential new friends you have schizophrenia?
• What support helps you? Family? Friends?
• What are your “extended thoughts” like?
• Why did you ask for voluntary hospital stay?
• What advice would you give others with sz? What would a peer support network mean to you?

Ryan says:

“Being diagnosed with schizophrenia was my second chance at life in a very, very weird way.”

“Paranoia can be a deep, dark road, especially if you’re not aware of it. ”

“I'm very happy with where I'm at. It's enough, where I can recognize that I have an illness and that I am hallucinating but not enough where my hallucinations run my life.”

“The great part about reality is that it’s shared. I was not sharing with other people.”   

" I will continue to listen to your podcast to understand the struggle my family goes through. In bits in pieces, of course, because too much of that at once could be an overload."

What helps Ryan: Advice to others with schizophrenia:

• Take your meds (when dosage reduced, hallucinations increase)
• Don’t smoke weed.
• Practice mindfulness. -  be aware of your “voices” and get out of your head.
• “You’re a genius. And I mean that people are always going to treat you like you're different, and you are. It takes an incredibly strong person to go through what you're going through. And it's not going to be easy, but God put that on you, for a reason and you're strong you're intelligent. One day you'll have the strength to confront your paranoia. Until then rely on your family, rely on your friends, rely on the people around you. It's okay to not be okay, but it's okay to be okay, too, and one day you'll be okay, I promise.”

Who Are the 3 Moms?

Want us to cover a topic? Ask us a question? Facebook page @Schizophrenia3Moms

Randye Kaye -Broadcaster, Actress, Voice Talent, Speaker, and Author (“Ben Behind his Voices”)

Miriam Feldman – Artist, Mom, Author “He Came in With It”

Mindy Greiling – member of the Minnesota House of Representatives for twenty years. Activist, Legislator, Author (“Fix What You Can“)

Want to know more?
Join our facebook page
Our websites:
Randye Kaye
Mindy Greiling
Miriam (Mimi) Feldman

Transcript

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Randye Kaye: This is episode 34 of our podcast and welcome to it, we are so excited to just have a conversation with a lovely young man who actually contacted me.

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Randye Kaye: and asked for the opportunity to share what his life is like and we're going to get to Ryan in in just a moment so Ryan just just hang with us for a second, I just want to say hello to our listeners if you're new to our podcast.

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Randye Kaye: you're here, so you obviously found us but we're schizophrenia three moms in the trenches and you can.

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Randye Kaye: stay in touch with what we're doing by heading to our Facebook page by subscribing to our podcast.

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Randye Kaye: By downloading other episodes and you can find all the links on our Facebook page or there's a page on band behind his voices.com you can click on podcasts and we have a little entry there so.

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Randye Kaye: Welcome, I want to thank corey from Facebook, who commented, and just said i'm so grateful, I came across your podcast.

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Randye Kaye: I feel lost a lot of times with my son's diagnosis, I feel, like every episode has given me some hope.

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Randye Kaye: So we are just thrilled about that and also from Nicole and Facebook, who says your life your podcast has been life saving for me to call has for special needs kids to have good to effective and one bipolar with psychosis and.

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Randye Kaye: she's got a lot on her plate the family has a lot on their plate it's not just them on and she says, because of your podcast i've been able to find resources, I wouldn't have known about otherwise unable to fight hard for my girls, armed with information and facts.

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Randye Kaye: So thank you that just that just makes our day our episode 33.

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Randye Kaye: has had over 400 downloads just in a week and that's a lot of people finding out about housing information so we're just glad to be here and be able to tell sides of the story and tonight.

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Randye Kaye: I want to share by saying I got an email, which I shared with my my friends in the trenches Mimi and mindy a young man Ryan wrote to me saying that and i'll just.

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Randye Kaye: read a little bit of the email just a tiny bit i'm a student and full time worker living with schizophrenia, and if you want to pick my brain i'm open.

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Randye Kaye: And I am so glad because we've been talking for a year about having our own sons on the podcast but mine isn't willing and doesn't want to tell his side of the story.

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Randye Kaye: So this opportunity just warmed my heart Ryan said I really appreciated your perspective in your podcast how I think about my illness.

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Randye Kaye: Rarely leaves my own world and thinking about how it affects my siblings and mom and dad is an interesting dynamic.

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Randye Kaye: And that meant a lot to me to hear that so, by the way, Ryan, has a master's degree and a job.

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Randye Kaye: And he will not be on camera, and we are not revealing his last name but applaud his courage to come out so out of respect for privacy all you'll see if you're on YouTube is his first name and no camera and Ryan just welcome we're so three moms are really glad you're here.

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Mindy Greiling MN: There we are, we definitely are.

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Ryan: Thank you so much for for having me, I came across your podcast by typing in schizophrenia in the podcast search bar try and find out more about my illness and trying to.

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Ryan: get some support, and it was fantastic hearing a mom's perspective, other than my mom.

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Ryan: My mom.

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Ryan: is an absolute sweetheart but hearing it in times for.

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Ryan: adds a little bit of weight.

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Ryan: A lot a lot of weight actually um so I appreciate you guys having me on the podcast today and yeah i'm open to any questions you have.

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Randye Kaye: that's awesome I, I just want to start by giving you the opportunity, you know as, as we said on the phone because Ryan, and I had a had a phone conversation as.

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Randye Kaye: As I said, my you know my son, who his real name is not revealed, but we call him Ben because that's a name, he chose for himself and he knew I was writing a book and my book is totally, from my perspective, my son's perspective is only shown in.

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Randye Kaye: In the poetry that he writes, so I include his poetry and otherwise, anyone who tells the story we're telling it from our own perspective, so he is not.

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Randye Kaye: ready to talk about his diagnosis, he doesn't call it an illness, he doesn't agree that he has it, but he calls that a diagnosis and he's aware that we all think he has this and.

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Randye Kaye: Right now he's he's doing well, maybe not quite as well as you with a master's degree, but he's he's he's doing well, and he has a good relationship with the family and so.

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Randye Kaye: I would love the chance to ask you the things I can ask my son, and the first question, I just if you would just you know start by just tell us your story.

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Randye Kaye: We have about 45 minutes total so i'd like to know a little bit just give us a background on your family and then, just like when your symptoms started like when your life began to change and we'll just jump in with questions if we have them.

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Ryan: My mom I have a mother a father brother and sister.

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Ryan: very, very talented brother and sister who continue to give me inspiration and support i'm a mom who is kind of like my drill surgeon um.

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Ryan: But I I absolutely I don't tell her all the time and it doesn't always come across but I appreciate the living I love her a lot and I appreciate her a lot.

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Ryan: And my dad.

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Ryan: He has a little softer approach, but he encourages me in a very fatherly way.

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Ryan: And I always appreciate his his openness with going down rabbit holes with me and helping me find my way out.

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Randye Kaye: hasn't always been like that or did you guys have a journey to get to this place of support like tell us a bit about what happened to you from your perspective.

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Ryan: So it's so hard, because I had a thing it's asking knows yeah.

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Ryan: i'm so not being aware of my onus everything is kind of posts me, looking back.

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Ryan: And it doesn't serve me well, looking back because there's a lot of pain and delusion in my past, and when I explore those places I find a lot of pain and delusion.

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Ryan: um, but I can tell you my sophomore year of college and I started to feel different I didn't know what I will I took I took acid, and I came out of that acid trip feeling different like I was never going to be the same.

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Ryan: And I don't think that I ever was.

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Ryan: So going into my junior year of college, it was a steady decrease lots of drugs xanax adderall acid.

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Ryan: and

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Ryan: I looking back now I feel as if I was in a lot of suffering um I was in a lot of pain, as much as.

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Ryan: I wasn't aware of it and.

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Ryan: I was trying to escape um I had a girlfriend that had cheated on me and that caused a lot of pain.

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Ryan: um but I wasn't aware of it, I just knew I had to escape.

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Ryan: And I went through it and very bad ways I wasn't a great influence on my friends, I was a.

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Ryan: Bad son to my mother um I use a lot of her money to fuel my drug habits.

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Ryan: um.

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Ryan: But I try to look at it through the frame of I was sick.

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Ryan: And being diagnosed with schizophrenia.

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Ryan: was my second chance at life in a very, very weird way to.

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Randye Kaye: say more about that what so you feel like college was more do you do you think partly the drug use was trying to escape from some symptoms of schizophrenia that were.

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Randye Kaye: That were starting to develop in you, you know Russell brand says, you know drugs were in my problem reality was my problem drugs were my solution and.

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Randye Kaye: So was something happening in your reality in terms of maybe having some hosts and nations are just having some psychosis or did you, you said you didn't feel the same ever so did your brain feel different and you were hoping to drugs would fix it can you.

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Ryan: I feel like.

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Ryan: I feel like I was.

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Ryan: I was experiencing paranoia and was unwilling to recognize that basis.

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Ryan: And paranoia can be a deep dark.

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Ryan: Road, especially if you're not aware of it.

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Ryan: So it led up to the first hospitalization hospitalization.

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Ryan: Where I was diagnosed with schizophrenia, and I didn't believe it, I was standing there like everything's fine like i'll be good like this is just a bump in the road.

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Ryan: But then the hallucinations persisted the voices for assisted.

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Ryan: The delusions persisted in the paranoia persistence so.

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Randye Kaye: How long were was that hospitalization and yeah like did you go on meds at that time, or like what would, what do you recall, was happening in your head.

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Ryan: It was voluntary.

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Ryan: um I chose to go to the hospital because I threat.

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Ryan: threaten to take my own life my friend's life.

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Ryan: And I knew enough to say.

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Ryan: I don't know if it was command voices i'm not sure.

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Ryan: But I knew enough, I actually I wanted to stay, I called my parents, I was like you have to come pick me up now.

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Ryan: And then I was like no don't pick me up i'm fine i'll figure it out.

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Randye Kaye: Take you.

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Randye Kaye: From the hospital or foe.

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Ryan: apologize from college.

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Randye Kaye: Okay now that's Okay, we just see if if I don't understand i'll just ask you.

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Randye Kaye: From knowledge, then okay.

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Ryan: From college and then.

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Ryan: After that.

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Ryan: They can't they will they came they picked me up and they were like.

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Ryan: Brian like can you to get help and, like, I was in the car being like i'm special i'm not special i'm gifted i'm not gifted and they were like now looking back they're probably like the psychotic in my head, I was still trying to figure stuff out.

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Mindy Greiling MN: i'm curious Ryan about your friends, you mentioned, I think you said you were using drugs with them and then later, you were said part of your delusion was.

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Mindy Greiling MN: To harm them and i'm wondering in your hindsight, now that you're you obviously are doing really well right now in your hindsight.

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Mindy Greiling MN: Could you do have any insight into your friends were they aware that you had delusions to harm them were they aware that drugs meant more to you than it did to them, because you were having also your symptoms of schizophrenia, or do you have any insight into that that you could share.

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Ryan: I do want to say that my best friend during that time is still my best friend and.

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Mindy Greiling MN: that's amazing that doesn't always happen.

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Ryan: he's been my best friend, since I was five and that support that love to be able to say, I want to hurt you and then for them to still be there is the most incredible.

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Ryan: I don't think there's a greater love on earth honestly.

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Mindy Greiling MN: that's fantastic that probably helps with your recovery, what do you think.

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Ryan: yeah and like during just to go back for a SEC during the time they weren't aware, but I was hiding my facial expressions, I was not telling people what I thought, so there was no way they could have known, because I can materialize and I was hiding.

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Ryan: um.

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Ryan: So I don't I did blame them for a bit.

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Ryan: um but I don't anymore, and it hurts more to blame them.

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Randye Kaye: Okay, so there's a lot of insight you have looking back, clearly, can you bring us back to that.

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Randye Kaye: Voluntary hospitalization like what.

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Randye Kaye: Because I know I know in my son's case he's never gone voluntarily it's always been.

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Randye Kaye: And he's been hospitalized nine times 10 nine whatever.

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It.

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Randye Kaye: It was never his choice.

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Randye Kaye: and

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Randye Kaye: But it was to his benefit to you know, to get treatment and, at the moment he's.

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Randye Kaye: that's adding to his stability but for you, you said you went voluntarily so, can you remember, and it must be really hard to revisit it so just you know tell us, whatever you're willing to tell us.

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Randye Kaye: You said, your thoughts were to harm yourself and possibly harm your friend and obviously that woke you up enough to.

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Randye Kaye: To go so did you call the hospital yourself, or like how did you get to the hospital and once you were there.

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Randye Kaye: Were you willing obviously has some detoxing to do, but are you willing to go on medication like what was that journey like for you in your recollection and what did it feel like in your head that's a lot of questions I know.

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Ryan: i'll try to i'll try to touch on them all, but I probably you'll have to remind me that's something my mom does really well.

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Oh.

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Ryan: So.

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Ryan: I call, because yeah I I knew I was I knew I was something was wrong that's why I called my mom and I was crying I actually called her crying saying, I want to kill myself mom.

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Ryan: And then I sat in my friend chris's arms for.

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Ryan: Like 30 minutes and just like cried and puke to felt like I was having an exorcism.

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Ryan: And my friend Ryan sitting on the bed, and he looked really depressed and I wanted to save him, but I.

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Ryan: I can I didn't know how to save myself.

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Ryan: And I with my hindsight, you can't save someone from depression like that that that was what was going through my head and I.

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Ryan: When I got to the hospital the doctor said.

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Ryan: i'm like do you want to hurt yourself, and I said.

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Ryan: Yes.

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Ryan: And, but.

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Ryan: I feel like I didn't like mean it.

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Randye Kaye: Okay.

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Ryan: Like I wanted to hurt myself, but I like I knew I was never going to go through with it like I was suffering, but I knew enough not to hurt myself or anyone else.

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Mindy Greiling MN: But the thoughts, you want.

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Mindy Greiling MN: Did you want to hurt yourself or did you think you had to hurt yourself, the reason I asked that is because part of my son's delusion is command voices that you mentioned earlier, he thinks he has to and he said delusions that he has to kill me or he has to.

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Mindy Greiling MN: burn himself or you know things like that, but he doesn't want to he just his delusion makes him think he has to, but he distinguishes between having to and wanting to be you have that kind of a nuance or not with your when you said you wanted to kill yourself.

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Ryan: i'm just to touch on the command voices a little bit um.

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Ryan: The the food, the way it sounds weird but the way I best deal with command voices when I do have them is to disassociate.

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Ryan: From my mind it's, the only way I can get there.

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Randye Kaye: And you say more what.

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Randye Kaye: What that how how that works.

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Ryan: it's just.

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Ryan: It feels like my breathing slows down and I tried to not think and detach.

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Ryan: my mind it's like I just go into like this trance of like.

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Ryan: it's my body being like okay like this is really scary just zone out and like slow your breath down and like.

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Ryan: Get.

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Ryan: Get out of your head and I do think a lot of that has to do with paranoia.

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Ryan: it's I feel like when you're paranoid you get a fight or flight response.

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Ryan: And you get like, in my experience anyways you get one chance, a day to like fight your paranoia and if you miss it.

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Ryan: you're retreating the rest of the day.

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Ryan: So if you keep trying to fight and retreat fighting retreat fight in retreat.

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Ryan: you end up cornering yourself and this like really dark place in your mind where the voices are just surrounding you and there's no way out and that's when the voices feel like they get to command voices because it's just like please voices get out of my head.

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Mindy Greiling MN: You still have voices, or do you does your medicine pretty much silence them.

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Ryan: um.

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Ryan: I my.

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Ryan: So I just went down on medication.

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Ryan: And for all the skits skits appendix listening out there to take your meds.

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Mindy Greiling MN: We like that in place as mothers can tell you that.

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Ryan: i'm don't smoke weed.

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Ryan: and

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Ryan: Practice mindfulness The rest is on you guys like can't really get more than that.

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Randye Kaye: Those are really three great tips I would imagine you had quite a journey to get from i'm in the hospital to where you are today, so can you can you kind of tell us like, and this is so helpful Thank you Ryan, and thanks again for your courage, can you tell us a bit about.

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Randye Kaye: Like how many hospitalizations Have you had Have you ever cheat your MIC up how many hospitalizations Have you had.

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Ryan: have had a have had to to voluntary hospitalizations okay.

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Randye Kaye: And where they for a good length of time or just like seven or eight days.

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Ryan: Four seven yeah seven days both times.

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Randye Kaye: Okay, so it was short and, and so I know you're currently on medication you've shared that have you ever tried to go off that medication and, if so, what happens.

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Ryan: All I know is when I went down on my medication my hallucinations got worse and I can't imagine a world.

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Ryan: Where they're much worse than they are like they're already distracting and I get an A trance sometimes so.

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Ryan: I can't really i'm very happy with where i'm at it's enough, where I can recognize that I have an illness and then I am hallucinating but not enough where my hallucinations around my life.

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Mindy Greiling MN: You said right now you're going down on your mess is that doctor's recommendation you just mean that on your own.

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Ryan: On my.

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path.

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Ryan: um I, as I said, I feel like i'm in a good place um do you mind if I do you mind if I go down on my medication and they said yeah and.

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Ryan: I medications release tricky because you want to be aware of your illness enough.

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Ryan: That you know it's there, but not enough that it controls your life, and I feel like i'm at that now.

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Mindy Greiling MN: That sounds better than just doing it on your own and that's really good that you're discussing sounds like had her hand up their.

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Randye Kaye: name is heather yeah.

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Miriam Feldman: yeah I have a question, this is the thing that always mystifies me is the issue and the nature of anosike knows yeah.

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Miriam Feldman: Now you sound right now, like you have a tremendous amount of insight and you know what's going on, and you, you know you identify things grow virally.

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Miriam Feldman: When you think back to before, when you said that you have Amazon knows yeah what does that feel like the memory is it like in some sort of a dream Do you remember the same things happening, but not understanding what was going on.

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Miriam Feldman: it's, something that would be really helpful to understand when we're dealing with our loved ones who have.

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Ryan: A.

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Ryan: It really I was medicated right when I.

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Ryan: went to hospital, the first time and I always knew I had schizophrenia, and from that point like an understanding, but I didn't feel like I experienced until I went down on my vacation.

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Miriam Feldman: So.

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Miriam Feldman: You knew, you had it because you were informed that you have it, or you just knew something was different.

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Ryan: Because I wasn't born mom because.

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Ryan: My.

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Ryan: Like my I was seeing the devil and like and, like my the the great part about reality said share and.

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Ryan: I was not sharing with other.

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Ryan: With the rest with other people in reality and I knew enough that I had that I was not.

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Ryan: That I had schizophrenia, but I didn't feel like I was experiencing.

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Randye Kaye: So it sounds and I know that from our conversation before and I also would imagine it's a.

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Randye Kaye: it's a struggle to.

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Randye Kaye: Actually, so surprised that you've said, my diagnosis of schizophrenia, because even on our phone conversation you weren't so sure you wanted to say that, so thank you for being willing to say that in this in this podcast it sounds to me like when.

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Randye Kaye: When the delusions get stronger or when your thoughts get stronger You used a different phrase on the phone with me it wasn't voices, but when when your thoughts get a little out of control and.

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Randye Kaye: doesn't feel like it steals you from your real reality of your friends and your family just does it feel isolating but you also have company, because everything going on in your head is about you.

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Ryan: yeah i'm.

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Ryan: So, so I know I have to like I understand when I have to get back to the present and get back to some sense of reality um but yeah you you hit it right on the head, I told you like, I am I.

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Ryan: hallucinate my subconscious.

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Ryan: i'm which I.

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Ryan: I i'm going back up into.

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Ryan: My head again but.

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Ryan: I hear the voices of my mom and my brother and.

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Ryan: My.

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Ryan: Ex girlfriend and my friends and sometimes I just hear.

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Ryan: Like a like a like a demonic voice um.

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Randye Kaye: Is it scary.

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Yes.

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Mindy Greiling MN: And you hear your mom's voice, because our son hears my voice sometimes and invariably for some reason this illnesses such a cruel illness.

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Mindy Greiling MN: i'm not saying nice things you know what he thinks I said and he's gotten, to the point where he reality checks with me he'll say.

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Mindy Greiling MN: Did you just say you hate me or something like that and i'm so grateful that he does so I can refute and say, of course I didn't say that I would never say that do you ever.

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Mindy Greiling MN: reality check like that or how you know, to me, it must be very tiring to have to sort out what somebody really said, compared to what inside your head said that they said, and how do you cope with that.

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Ryan: A finding the courage to ask hey What did you just say.

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Mindy Greiling MN: Did you do that wonderful it.

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Ryan: So sometimes i'm so in my head i'm like I go to the top i'm like I know exactly what you said.

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Ryan: And I when I.

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Ryan: When I do, that I should.

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Ryan: slow down and apologize, and just for clarification takes it.

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Ryan: takes a little bit of courage but i'm getting there.

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Mindy Greiling MN: Do you ever have a sense of humor about it, because you know every now and then all of us when we're on this this program when we share things that everybody else would think would be horrible.

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Mindy Greiling MN: which we can actually get to laughing about it, and sometimes I do that with my son to where you know things just seem so funny to us if we're in the right mood have you you ever find any humor in what you're going through.

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Ryan: A occasionally when i'm in a good routine and.

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Ryan: I feel.

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Ryan: I feel like in a groove or like repetitious i'm like and like nothing bothers me and I get like that, sometimes, and it feels like the whole world melts around.

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Ryan: else around me, and I can.

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Ryan: Like.

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Ryan: my joy starts coming back.

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Ryan: My i'm.

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Ryan: Like I can laugh, and I can I can be with the people I love and I take that for granted, sometimes being in that group but um I think my mom and.

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Ryan: she's she's incredible and she she'll still hit me that, like keep me on the ground and my dad will pull up a funny YouTube video and.

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Ryan: we'll laugh sometimes i'm honestly i'm still at the point where i'm pretty like even right now, like my palms are sweaty i'm like sweating i'm not feeling.

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Ryan: I get I get.

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Ryan: I get it's not easy, so the moments I do find laughter are.

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Ryan: moments to cherish for sure.

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Mindy Greiling MN: And you're taking a big risk, you know to be on here and sharing with us so that could be contributing to your sweaty palms too, but you know I.

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Mindy Greiling MN: I think it's so admirable that you're talking like this, because you know people that listen to our podcast will take so much hope from the insights that you have and how rational you're doing, and you can.

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Mindy Greiling MN: Think about your illness and talk about it this way, I think it's gives great hope to other families and other people with mental illnesses, who are listening to and what the what gives you hope, how do you feel hopeful about your future What helps the most.

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Ryan: uh two things one is a shared truth and the other is that i'm boss like i'm a genius I know that they can get into a realm of delusion but i'm like I have 4.0 master's degree I i'm i'm good son now.

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Ryan: um and.

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Ryan: I I I do a lot of good things in my life I pick up a sock every once in a while I do the dishes I take out the garbage and.

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Ryan: And my mom.

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Ryan: Like we tell each other, we love each other all the time and the fact that.

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Ryan: The fact that.

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Ryan: That world we're all here to share amazing moments and.

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Ryan: i'm sorry I forgot the question.

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Mindy Greiling MN: Why would you answer that yeah what gives you hope.

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Mindy Greiling MN: And so I think you didn't answer that but one of the programs, we did we had someone on who had there was plenty a to.

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Mindy Greiling MN: Who was doing really well, like you, are, and then we heard from someone a mother, I think, whose daughter wasn't doing so well, and she didn't see that she was ever going to do well.

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Mindy Greiling MN: If you and hopefully that will change but have you had a chance to.

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Mindy Greiling MN: interact either maybe not in the psych Ward where you weren't doing well, yourself, but other places where you see the spectrum of people doing really well or middling or not so well and and do you have any advice or hope for those who aren't doing as well.

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Ryan: You guys are probably gonna hate me for this, but like you're a genius.

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Ryan: And I mean that people are always going to treat you like you're different, and you are it takes an incredibly strong person to go through what you're going through.

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Ryan: And it's not going to be easy, but God put that on you, for a reason and you're strong you're intelligent.

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Ryan: You one day you'll have the strength to confront new paranoia until then rely on your family rely on your friends rely on the people around you.

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Ryan: and

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Ryan: it's okay to not be okay, but it's okay to be okay, too, and one day you'll be okay, I promise.

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Mindy Greiling MN: I.

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Randye Kaye: will add to that what you said before, which was take your meds mindfulness and there was the third tip that you gave so how hard, is it for you to stay away from drugs now or is that part of your recovery.

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Ryan: When I went down on the medication, I can.

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Ryan: lot of realizations in a short period of time, but.

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Ryan: i'm that.

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Ryan: I hallucinate like I am we'd like I don't I don't need my isn't my.

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Ryan: The brain is the brain is very uh.

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Ryan: it's a constant weed smokers very similar to some of the schizophrenia, and I hallucinate I don't need.

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Ryan: I don't need to hallucinate more.

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Ryan: To give you insight into why did smoke weed, though.

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Ryan: It doesn't help with my head at all, but it did elevate my feeling.

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Ryan: And it's.

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Ryan: Without we I get.

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Ryan: I get sweaty like I feel like I like I don't I go back to place of it feels like a lack of feeling and we'd help me get out of it, I.

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Ryan: I don't.

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Ryan: Think i'm trying my best not to need it.

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Ryan: um.

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Ryan: But um it is tough but.

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Miriam Feldman: I know you say to people, you said it earlier don't smoke weed what are you basing that off.

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Ryan: I don't need to hallucinate more than a hallucinate now.

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Miriam Feldman: So that you you've assessed intellectually that smoking weed does not benefit you but emotionally sometimes you feel drawn towards it.

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Ryan: Yes, I see.

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Miriam Feldman: And I have a question also you, you said you're still friends with this one friend that you've been friends with since you're a young child.

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Miriam Feldman: And do you have a social life and friends and people that you've met since you been diagnosed and move back into your life.

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Ryan: No, but I hope today's the first, the first step towards that.

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Miriam Feldman: And so.

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Miriam Feldman: Tell me, if this is uncomfortable and i'll stop, but this is one of the things that just pains me so much about my son is his isolation and until I really have a yearning to understand that so um so you want to have interaction with people, but you do tend to just.

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Miriam Feldman: Separate yourself, or are you just I mean you, you work a job and you work with people correct.

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Ryan: yeah I work from home so everything's over the over the phone, which makes it a lot easier on me.

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Miriam Feldman: And you know.

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Ryan: I do.

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Randye Kaye: And you're 25 Ryan right.

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Randye Kaye: Yes, yeah so it's just mid 20s our sons are about a decade past us so that it's good to know.

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Randye Kaye: um.

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Randye Kaye: So you know I always talk about i'm not the only one, but you know when i've spoken to health practitioners and families, about what what we find for hope in our family.

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Randye Kaye: And I always say you know, there are four pillars to doing well with this illness really any illness is stuff we all need and one is treatment, whatever that treatment is for you and one is structure.

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Randye Kaye: And purpose like having a purpose you clearly you hit, you are a genius you have a master's degree, and you have a job so job gives you purpose, and I know with my son when Kobe.

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Randye Kaye: made his job go away was really tough and the fourth thing is love you know community and love and it sounds like you've got your family on your side you've got your most important friends on your side.

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Randye Kaye: What and again if you're uncomfortable just say i'd rather not answer that and we will just move on.

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Randye Kaye: What.

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Randye Kaye: When you're trying to make new friends.

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Randye Kaye: and acquaintances one thing and a Co worker is one thing, my son worked in a restaurant, for a long time, and never told anyone he has schizophrenia so and I get that because.

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Randye Kaye: He didn't need to and he wouldn't have been hired and it's all that but.

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Randye Kaye: When you think about having other relationships in your life, maybe one day having a girlfriend and maybe you have one now I don't know or another close friend at what at some point, do you ever say look I you know.

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Randye Kaye: I have this illness, and this is what it means, and if you see me gesturing weirdly i'm just having a moment and I need to go and be mindful or.

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Randye Kaye: Is that going to be part of your journey to self acceptance to letting select people know just people close to you know about your illness or a stigma really get in the way of that.

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Ryan: I told equal like on tinder and bumble.

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Randye Kaye: we're on tinder.

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Randye Kaye: For you okay.

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Ryan: good for you for telling.

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Mindy Greiling MN: People on social media.

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Randye Kaye: Well, those are dating Apps it's not quite social media it's more of a private thing right.

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Mindy Greiling MN: or bad okay that.

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Mindy Greiling MN: Dates me cuz I didn't quite know a tinder.

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Randye Kaye: it's a dating APP you swipe left.

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Mindy Greiling MN: or so you're.

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Mindy Greiling MN: just talking to a small to whoever your interact.

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Randye Kaye: To yeah right Ryan, do I have that right.

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Ryan: yeah and in a private.

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Ryan: Private message i'll say I have schizophrenia.

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Ryan: So I told one person she ran away.

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Ryan: I told another person and.

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Ryan: She was I was like I hallucinate.

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Ryan: And that's where I left it at because I was a little afraid because the last one.

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Ryan: But when i'm making new friends, I don't know if I want new friends, but if I make new friends.

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Ryan: I feel like it should be something tell them when i'm ready it's tough because.

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Ryan: it's tough because it's part of my identity, a little bit.

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Ryan: So if you were.

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Ryan: A nice like a generous person wouldn't hide that but I have to be selective about who I share part of my identity with.

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Miriam Feldman: And what is the reason for that, because of their preconceptions about what having schizophrenia means or because it would scare them away.

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Ryan: scare them away, I think I have a delusion that someone can take advantage of it.

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Miriam Feldman: That may not be a delusion.

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Randye Kaye: There may be a suspicion.

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Randye Kaye: it's a fine line, I know, but it could be based on truth there are people who would and there are many people who don't understand it so that's why we.

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Mindy Greiling MN: Have I was asking earlier about friends you've met.

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Mindy Greiling MN: You know that also have a mental illness, because you know my son is older than you and all his friends have a mental illness, the ones, he started out with he wasn't.

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Mindy Greiling MN: fortunate, like you, are to have a friend who stuck with him a couple of them dead for a couple of years, you know but kind of way because they.

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Mindy Greiling MN: Their lives changed, and they weren't dealing with all the things he was dealing with so they just didn't have as much in common, but Jim Jim has some really good friends think people he camps with and.

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Mindy Greiling MN: And you know goes to restaurants or coffee shops, but they really like bars to.

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Mindy Greiling MN: And and it's all people like him who have a mental illness, it might not be schizophrenia, but some other type of mental illness and then they have that connection, which they never talked about.

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Mindy Greiling MN: But they still have that empathy and if Jim ever starts to not feel good and has to go home and mentions that they're fine with that or they cancel at the last minute, but you haven't met any people like that yet at your young age, it sounds like.

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Ryan: I have one friend who has bipolar and I feel like he, like gets me.

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Ryan: I probably push myself too hard and situations, I could be like, I want to go home but i'm like I gotta show people normally.

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Ryan: So.

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Mindy Greiling MN: That tug and Paul how about your siblings do they how do they roll with your illness.

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Ryan: Of.

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Mindy Greiling MN: My brother's my attention you get or resentful or or How does that go.

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Ryan: my brother always.

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Ryan: I don't want to sound bad, but he always make sure that.

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Ryan: i'm listening to and that he is listened to by my family.

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Ryan: and

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Ryan: He has to stick up for themselves sometimes or it would all be about me wow.

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Randye Kaye: and your sister.

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Ryan: my sister is a soldier or she is going to be a soldier.

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Ryan: And um.

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Ryan: She treats life with the occasional case on laughing but she treats life, unlike a soldier and she's strong and tough and if something's bothering her.

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Ryan: She so let me kind of have the way, most of the time, and just let me amy i'm good she she's so brave and so tough and she's a big part of my life.

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Randye Kaye: You sound like a very, very.

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Randye Kaye: empathetic just so we know we have about five minutes left and two things I really don't want to leave out one is because i'm wishing for you as you continue to grow in your life.

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Randye Kaye: That you find continue to have the love that you have from your family and close friends and that you also have a community of people who get you in that way, I know, at the moment, my son, he was not very happy when he was your age and he was in a group home and.

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Randye Kaye: In a community of people who had mental health issues, and I think it's because he was 25 and they were all 40 but now he's 39.

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Randye Kaye: He doesn't hate, you know he.

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Randye Kaye: He he is actually enjoying being part of that community but also has hopes for his future.

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Randye Kaye: So I wish for you some Community I think part of the problem with especially schizophrenia, and anything with psychosis is, it is very isolating.

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Randye Kaye: And I think that that Community even beyond your family, I hope that that is something that that you get.

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Randye Kaye: So I just want to say that, and I know this is your first time it was it was assumed that you were.

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Randye Kaye: out speaking to groups, all the time and telling your story, and you said no, this is my first time so I want to acknowledge the bravery of taking that step, thank you and I want to know it, if you have you we have five minutes left.

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Randye Kaye: The question you wanted us to ask our sons because mindy did get a chance to ask it and and then anything else you want us to know that.

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Randye Kaye: You want to get across in this podcast because I know you sent me a venn diagram and I finally understand it, because my husband knows what a venn diagram is.

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Randye Kaye: You, and if you want, I can kind of put it in the show notes, but you were trying to explain to me what it feels like to have schizophrenia, and I so appreciated.

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Randye Kaye: The effort you put into it and I had to really look at it, to try to understand it so, but this is a podcast So if you can you know, maybe tell us what you want us to know and then pose that question and mindy can answer it has two parts.

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Ryan: let's do the question, yes.

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Randye Kaye: You asked us to ask us a question and what was the question.

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Ryan: The question was what do you think about when no one's around what do you do when you're frustrated.

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Ryan: and

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Ryan: what's his recovery from mental health breakdown look like to you.

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Mindy Greiling MN: So I asked you about what does he think about when when no one else is around and he thinks about I was sorry to hear.

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Mindy Greiling MN: And i'm glad you asked it, so I had a chance to have insight into this question and he'll say answer i'm sorry to hear that what he thinks about.

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Mindy Greiling MN: His his continuing delusion he never gets away from it, and if he's isolating he goes back to that delusion which is.

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Mindy Greiling MN: A scary one, and now the design class up in a really good and I psychotic for him and many other people he doesn't I thought he kind of ditched it, but no it's still there when he's by himself and he's ruminating.

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Mindy Greiling MN: And I asked him, you know what do you do when you're frustrated about that, and he said I just think I don't have time for this I don't have time for this I don't want to have.

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Mindy Greiling MN: be thinking about this delusion I don't want to have a an attack, where I need to take extra meds because of how i'm feeling so that was his answer and then the part about the recovery he.

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Mindy Greiling MN: He is he thinks it's important that he's working he works part time that he has friends that he's got a great psychiatrist he's taking really good medications now and he's like you.

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Mindy Greiling MN: He really appreciates his family and friends, so I think what you've been telling us for this whole program is actually he boiled down in his answer, so I appreciated that you ask those questions, and so I had that conversation with my son, so thank you Ryan that's.

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Ryan: that's incredible it's it's amazing to hear someone else who succeeding and.

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Ryan: If your son's ever want to get in touch with me they're more than welcome to send me that well Randy has my email yeah.

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Randye Kaye: And, have you.

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Mindy Greiling MN: wish you could meet in person I wish all of our sons could meet in person, because.

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Mindy Greiling MN: Hearing my son never got into social media he's he doesn't do that, so he has to meet people in person.

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Ryan: yeah um if there's ever an opportunity, or if there's a meeting something where I can attend and within driving range I would love to love to meet your songs i'd love to joining a community.

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Mindy Greiling MN: They all would.



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Randye Kaye: I mean it's not I mean, I know that my son.

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Randye Kaye: writes a lot he writes a lot of poetry he just he's having a tough time where he's living right now, because three people got coven so.

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Randye Kaye: Again, three of his pals, one of whom used to knock on his door every morning and go hey Ben let's go for coffee, they were all isolated so he's.

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Randye Kaye: You know, physically isolated and so he's I said, have you been spending your time he said just writing writing writing and I don't know what he writes about, but I think that's how he.

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Randye Kaye: manages extra thoughts i'll just call them extra thoughts he gets them on paper.

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Randye Kaye: So I know that much Mimi anything to add to that and then i'll.

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Miriam Feldman: Give.

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out yeah.

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Miriam Feldman: Nick to my son's an artist visual ours, so he sometimes he writes and writes and notebooks ideas for paintings other time, and this is what he does with his extra thoughts and.

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Miriam Feldman: Or else he actually paint, but a lot of time he doesn't paint because it's maybe what's going on in his head is more than he wants to.

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Miriam Feldman: dwell on because when you paint because i'm a painter as well, when you paint your really inside of yourself, you know you're really present.

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Miriam Feldman: and false or what you're using so I finally understood that maybe a lot of the time he doesn't want to dwell in that, but what he does, then, is he will is sort of.

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Miriam Feldman: calming things he'll draw and coloring books.

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Miriam Feldman: Because for him just moving color across the surface is what he was born to do, and if you can't.

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Miriam Feldman: Take on the whole thing of his psyche and and brain and everything that's going on, that has said in his own color functional draw all night long he'll draw for hours.

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Miriam Feldman: And that's his way but Ryan, I was going to save you also you know we all have this wonderful doctor who's in upstate New York or New York, and he has a whole group of kids and most of them are guys.

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Miriam Feldman: With young women too, and in the summertime he does sort of get together thing where everybody comes and we went last year, and now.

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Miriam Feldman: mindy that you're sending treatment by delta related to that might be something that you would want to join us, this summer, where you can meet a bunch of kids.

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Miriam Feldman: Who are all doing real well because they're all on calls if you and they're all having good meaningful lines, I think that might be nice nice for you to join us.

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Ryan: yeah I would love to plus be in towns and i've listened, a lot of your podcasts.

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Ryan: cause a pain seems to be.

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Ryan: very effective and really being for living.

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Ryan: more productive lives so that's interesting.

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Randye Kaye: is to be administered correctly so and it's not the answer for everybody, my son hated it i'm.

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Randye Kaye: At right now is on something else so it's you know we we never want this podcast to be all about closer oh if If so, they would be sponsoring us so, but it is something it is an option, so thank you and I want.

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Mindy Greiling MN: to lay.

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Mindy Greiling MN: out website changer for my son, I would say i'm not a commercial list, but in my in our particular case it's night and day for Jim are you on the right hand or not.

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No.

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Ryan: No okay well you're doing well, anyway, so.

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Mindy Greiling MN: Obviously, other drugs work too right.

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Randye Kaye: I will, I will send you the website, just so that you can look and see that there you know even just knowing their other people I might just also suggest on tinder that when you're if you're revealing that you say something like I hate to give advice, but i'm going to you know.

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Randye Kaye: I have, I have schizophrenia it's very functional and it's managed with medication like just if you're going to put it up front put it up front, because if you know anyone who's.

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Randye Kaye: will understand it will know that's a very different animal from untreated schizophrenia so just a thought, what else in your final minutes, would you most like to say to our listeners or to us that we have you haven't had a chance to cover.

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Randye Kaye: You know what what does support look like to you anything you want to say i'm just going to leave it open is there anything you want us to understand about you that you haven't had a chance to say.

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Ryan: uh I continually try to push towards the President, and what that means is, I think, neither like right down but.

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I.

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Ryan: The advice that you guys gave today was fantastic i'd love to be part of a group that is supportive and understanding of me and, like you, guys and like.

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Ryan: Other people with schizophrenia.

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Ryan: And yeah I, I will continue to try to push towards a President, and thank you guys, for having me on the podcast today, and it was a joy.

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Ryan: i'm glad to hear that your sons are pushing towards their own sense of the President and normalcy and love and purpose enjoy and all the good things in life.

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Ryan: So thank you for having me today and.

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Mindy Greiling MN: we're all smiling if everyone can't.

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Mindy Greiling MN: The pod.

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Randye Kaye: I think Ryan can see us we just can't, so I think you can feel the love and.

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Randye Kaye: If you are listening out there, and you are feeling like Ryan, and you, maybe you have schizophrenia and you're listening to our podcast I know there's a few people that comment on YouTube.

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Randye Kaye: You know, feel free to put something in the comments or to write to me, you know my our emails are at the end of every podcast you can get in touch with any one of us and say you know.

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Randye Kaye: I I also have schizophrenia and feel like I need a Community and we can we can pass that information on to you Ryan, if you want.

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Randye Kaye: Or maybe we'll even do a show or three or four people with schizophrenia Come on, I mean we would love to be we'll just stay in the background i'll let you guys talk to each other, that would be it's just just an idea, but we, you know, we want to, we want to be a.

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Randye Kaye: conduit for you to get some support Ryan as well, and we just so appreciate your being here today, and thank you.

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Ryan: you're welcome and.

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Mindy Greiling MN: Thank you out international clubhouse area best guest on that's the director of that and just today, I was talking with people in Minnesota we're working on starting one in my area so check out if there's one in your area that's meet people like yourself.

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Ryan: I will I love that episode you guys did I like I was he whoever was the guest did a fantastic job of.

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Ryan: Making me feel less alone, I was like I want to, I want to, I want to be part of something like that, so I.

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Ryan: Look, I will definitely look into clubhouses for sure.

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Mindy Greiling MN: awesome.

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Randye Kaye: Great Thank you so much.

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Mindy Greiling MN: And thank you.

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Randye Kaye: for joining us.

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Ryan: yeah Thank you guys.

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Randye Kaye: that's it.

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Miriam Feldman: Right i'm going to.